Blooming at Denver PrideFest: Matt Kailey interviews Grand Marshal Donna Rose

She’s a nationally recognized speaker, author and activist, not to mention a computer whiz and a knockout in an evening gown. As well spoken as she is outspoken, trans activist Donna Rose has served on several national boards, presented on trans issues all over the country and authored a popular book, Wrapped in Blue, about her gender transition from male to female. Now Donna Rose will be appearing at Denver PrideFest 2008 as the Grand Marshal. I caught up with her before her appearance here to ask her about the T in GLBT, the importance of community and her resignation from the HRC board of directors amid the controversy of ENDA.

Matt Kailey: Some people see the focus of a Pride celebration as gay and lesbian pride and rights. What part does the trans community play in a Pride celebration?
Donna Rose: GLB and T are not as different or separate from one another as some seem to believe. We all challenge society’s stereotypical expectations of what it means to be a man or a woman in this culture. We all struggle with lifetimes of shame and guilt and fear at discovery. We all share the difficult process of coming out to ourselves, to family, to friends and the devastating loss that these things sometimes involve. We all deal with varying degrees of harassment at school, at work and in our daily lives. The fact that there are opportunities to set that all aside, to leave our dark closets and to come together as a community to celebrate the pride we feel in being who and what we are should not and cannot be limited to specific kinds of people in the broader GLBT spectrum. Pride is a celebration of authenticity, and in that way, Pride is for everyone.

MK: What does it mean to you to be Grand Marshal of Denver PrideFest?
DR: I am tremendously honored and proud to be the Grand Marshal of Denver PrideFest this year. I think it’s indicative of the realization that GLB and T are not necessarily separate from one another, but that we overlap in some significant and important ways. The fact that I have always been attracted to women and that hasn’t changed means that the rest of society perceives me as a lesbian, so any number of the letters of our alphabet-soup can apply. I hope my participation will help others realize that we’re all in this together, and that Pride is for everyone.

MK: What will you be speaking about at PrideFest?
DR: When I speak at PrideFest I will be stressing the concept of “community.” We all face similar challenges in schools, in workplaces, at places of worship and out in society. If the recent murder of 14-year-old Lawrence King in Oxnard highlights anything, it’s that these outdated labels really don’t apply. Was he killed because he acknowledged that he was gay, or because he acted and dressed in ways that are traditionally feminine? Others apply letters to label us. We need to recognize that we’re all in this together and, as such, are all one community.

A community isn’t something that you’re part of simply because of shared traits or characteristics. Community is something you’re part of because you actually choose to belong. It’s a spirit, a sense of common purpose. For those of us who faced our fears alone, who always felt isolated and alone, the realization that there is a community of people united by courage, by authenticity and by the freedom to be who and what they are is tremendously empowering. Community is a foundational concept of Pride, and I think it’s important to stress this now more than ever.

All my work on local and national levels has been about “community.” I find myself as a bridge builder simply by being at the table as a board member: at HRC, at GLAAD, at the National Gay and Lesbian Chamber of Commerce. I don’t perceive myself simply as a transgender outsider looking in. I perceive myself as part of the broader GLBT community, with a unique perspective to share.


MK: How do you think trans people are misunderstood by the GLB community?
DR: I think trans people, in general, are as misunderstood by the GLB community as they are by the rest of the broader society. When I joined our Employee Resource Group at Dell I had someone approach me after about a year to thank me for helping her to learn about “transgender.” She acknowledged that the entire concept of it had made her uncomfortable, but that by knowing me and learning, it had helped her to understand. I think that’s typical of many in the GLB community, and the only way for us to learn about one another is by sharing, by working together and by helping each other overcome our own phobias we often don’t realize we have.

MK: How can the trans community help and support the GLB community and vice versa?
DR: There are lots of things trans people can do to support the GLB community. They can join GLBT organizations that align with their passions (PFLAG, the Task Force, GLAAD or HRC) or simply for the social aspects that being involved can provide. They can actively support legislation to support the GLB community: Marriage Equality and the repeal of “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell,” to name just a couple. If the trans community wants the broader GLB community to stand up for them, they need to be able to do the same in return.

I’m a big believer that there are no “levels” of equality. There is equality, and there is something less. None of us can afford to accept something less. The only way for us all to get there is for us to hold true to our ideals of fairness, of community, of protecting those of us who need it most, and to demand nothing less. The more of us who speak in a unified voice, the better the chance it will happen.

MK: You resigned from the HRC national board over their stance on ENDA. What is your relationship to HRC now?
DR: I did resign from HRC over ENDA. It was a very painful and difficult decision for me because I strongly believed in the ideals of equality and justice for all that I felt the organization stood for. I had invested quite a bit of my time, my energy, my reputation, my money and my passion in it. However, based on their decision, and more specifically how I felt I was handled during that process, I could not in good conscience align myself with an organization that did not have the same commitment to “community” as I did. I believed then, and continue to believe, that one of the most important things that any of us has is our credibility. Political “realities” or expediency aside, my continuing disappointment with their political strategy isn’t specifically what happened, it’s how it happened.

I don’t know that I have a relationship with HRC at the moment, or at least a formal one that I can define. I’m doing what I can to find common ground so that some sort of healing can take place. I’m not willing to debate what happened over ENDA (or why) at this point because what’s done is done. We need to find a way to move past it. I’m supportive of their continuing Foundation efforts – Workplace, Coming Out, Faith. I hold out hope that I will find a way to establish a relationship with them again someday, but that depends on them as much as it does on me.

MK: Does a non-inclusive ENDA hurt the gay and lesbian community? If so, how?
DR: I think it would be inaccurate to say that a non-inclusive ENDA somehow “hurts” the gay and lesbian community. I do believe, and analysis by Lambda Legal has backed this up, that a non-inclusive ENDA has several significant flaws in it that significantly weaken it when compared to the fully inclusive version. But to think that passing Federal Legislation that protects gays and lesbians from being fired in the workplace somehow “hurts” them would be misguided.

It’s important to recognize that the concept of “transgender” involves how people are perceived as being “manly” or “womanly” enough by others. People’s expression of their gender doesn’t need to have anything to do with self-identifying as part of the transgender community – gender non-conformity is simply an expression of personal freedoms. However, it puts them at risk when compared to the expectations that others have for men and women.

MK: The whole situation around ENDA appears to have caused a rift within the GLBT community. How can we heal that rift – or is it necessary to heal it? Can it be good for the community to have various factions working in various ways, even if everyone is not in agreement?
DR: Actually, I would disagree with that statement. I don’t know that ENDA exposed a rift so much as it actually united the broader community. The entire concept of United ENDA, where over 400 local, state and national GLBT organizations stood up for a fully inclusive ENDA, indicates unity and solidarity like never before. I think the notion of a “rift” happened because the most significant player in the GLBT political world, the Human Rights Campaign, chose to stand alone in supporting the non-inclusive version of ENDA that eventually got passed.

I’d go a step further to say that what happened over ENDA last fall had far more bright spots than blemishes and bodes well for the future. I truly believe that once we’ve had an opportunity to see what happened in the context of time, we’ll see it as a unifying time, a time of increased awareness and a time of broader community acceptance. It has opened doors for broader education. It will lead to Congressional Hearings in Washington, D.C. on transgender workplace challenges later this spring. It has highlighted who our friends truly are, as well as those who need further education. As far as I’m concerned, these are all good things.

One of the fallacies of ENDA is the notion that it will change workplace conditions for GLBT people overnight. The fact of the matter is that we need to do the deeper-dive education to ensure that workplaces are accepting and aware of what this legislation means. Corporate America is far ahead of the rest of our culture in GLBT acceptance, so we’ve got strong allies there. If we continue the work we’ve been doing, we can ensure that the ENDA that gets passed is more than simply symbolic, and that it truly ensures that GLBT employees can go to work each day assured that they will not lose their job simply because someone chooses to discriminate against them.

How can the damage be healed? That’s simple. By working together to pass a fully inclusive ENDA in 2009. We had the “luxury” last year of battling over legislation that faced an all-but-certain presidential veto if it passed both houses of Congress. In 2009, when this battle begins again, there will be a more accepting president in place so the prospects of actually making it law become much more real. It’s critical that we work together between now and then to do the education to secure the votes, that we learn from what happened last autumn and that we work together so we don’t come to that same fork in the road that we did last time, only to have key players flinch.

I don’t think there’s anyone advocating for a non-inclusive ENDA. The difference is that some will accept something less, while others won’t.

MK: What would you like the Colorado GLBT community to know about you?
DR: Although I am no longer involved with HRC, I remain active nationally in GLBT efforts. I am still on the board of GLAAD and of the National Gay and Lesbian Chamber of Commerce. I am on the Board of Advisors for the National Center for Transgender Equality, and on the Transgender Advisory Committee for Out and Equal Workplace Advocates. I am involved in national Transgender Education through TransEducate, and I continue to speak at workplaces, conferences and schools around the country on transgender and broader GLBT issues. I will be returning to Denver in August to participate in the Stonewall Democrats convention there, and will be a co-chair at the Out and Equal Workplace Summit in Austin, Texas in September.

At the moment, I live outside of Phoenix, Arizona, with my brand new puppy, Maggie, a 9-week-old Australian Shepherd. My son, who is 22, lives here, too.
In my “professional” life, I am an Information Technology Consultant to Fortune 500 companies, where I lead large IT projects and programs.

MK: What else would you like to say?
DR: There fewer than a half-dozen cities in this country that come to mind when I think about moving somewhere new to live. Denver is on that list.
I look forward to being able to meet as many people as I can during PrideFest. The reason I do the things I do is largely because I have the honor of meeting the most amazing people, and it’s a privilege to be in a position to help.
Thanks to everyone who helped to make this possible. I look forward to thanking you all in person.

For more information about Donna Rose, go to www.donnarose.com.